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Five trips, nearly $13,000: Money well spent?

Saturday, December 6, 2008 11:45 PM PST

By Tony Lystra

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In early August, Connie Fauver, a corrections officer at the Cowlitz County Jail, flew to Savannah, Ga., for a three-day conference called “Motivating Generation X & Y for Optimum Performance.”

Fauver, who trains many of the jail’s new hires, said her supervisors had offered to let her attend the course partly as an award for her hard work. “It was kind of like an appreciation,” she said last week. “They said, ‘Hey, do you want to attend a class? We’ve got it in the budget somewhere.’ ”

She said she came home with valuable information about the differences between older and younger workers.

The $1,775 trip is one of the dozens of excursions county employees take each year at a cost of hundreds of thousands of dollars to the taxpayer.

County officials say a strict travel policy and frugal ethic keep spending under control. But Commissioner Axel Swanson said the board of commissioners, which must approve all out-of-state travel, has never turned down a trip during his two years with the county.

“To be honest with you, I haven’t seen one where I’ve thought, ‘Why is this occurring or why are they going to this?’” Swanson said. “Typically that doesn’t happen with travel because it’s been vetted up through a department head.”

Commissioner George Raiter said the board doesn’t “try to micromanage any department heads or elected officials’ decisions on training.”

Still, the question arises: Are these taxpayer-funded jaunts worth the money, especially as the county faces a $5.8 million deficit next year? You be the judge.

Using the state’s open records law, The Daily News obtained receipts from five trips taken by county employees this month, costing a total of $12,718. The newspaper selected the trips based on simple criteria: They involved distant travel and interesting subject matter.

In one case, four of the jail’s corrections officials were sent to Florida earlier this summer to learn how to keep inmates from reoffending once they’re released. In another, two prosecutors drove to Vancouver, B.C., for a conference about shaken baby syndrome. A health official flew to Sacramento to meet with her colleagues and present a paper. And a sheriff’s deputy traveled to Las Vegas to learn from experts about a condition called “excited delirium.”

The county’s 2008 budget lays out $276,500 for travel expenses, including airfare, hotel stays, meals, mileage, conference registration fees and tuition. (The county had spent $174,000 of that as of this year’s third quarter, the most recent figures available. The Sheriff’s office maintains a separate $25,125 fund to pay for travel involved with extraditing prisoners.)

Travel spending amounts to a relative pittance – 0.6 percent — of the county’s $42 million general fund budget. And commissioners said the travel is necessary in many cases to keep the county’s workforce well-trained. In other cases, they said, it’s simply valuable to see what other professionals are doing.

County officials stressed in interviews last week that they don’t live extravagantly when they’re on the road.

“We are very conscientious that we are spending the taxpayers’ money and we want it to benefit them,” said Alicia Thompson, the health department’s Deputy Director of Communicable Disease and Community Health, who traveled to the Sacramento health conference in September.

“If it’s going to cost less to take a red-eye, we’ll take a red-eye.”

The county’s travel policy limits compensation for meals to $40 per day, or $10 for breakfast, $12 for lunch and $18 for dinner. And, according to the policy, the county won’t pay for luxuries such as alcohol, valets or sightseeing trips.

Indeed, the newspaper found no $100 bottles of wine among the receipts.

Yet, facing the worst budget crisis in nearly a decade, commissioners and department heads are reining in travel plans for next year.

The sheriff’s office, which spends more on travel than any other county department to keep its staff trained, said Thursday it plans to reduce travel spending by roughly $10,000 next year, from more than $50,000 in 2008 to $40,679.

“Training and travel is always the first on the chopping block,” Swanson said. “You’re going to see that with this (2009) budget we adopt this month.”

But Hauge, the finance director, said it’s only prudent to cut travel costs by so much.

“It’s a one-time cut,” she said. “We need more permanent cuts than that. We need sufficiently trained staff, and cutting these few thousand dollars is not going to get us where we need to be.”

Following are discussions with five county employees about trips they took this year and how they believe those trips benefitted taxpayers.

Connie Fauver, corrections officer, Cowlitz County Jail

Motivating Generation X and Y for Optimum Performance, Savannah, Ga.

Aug. 3-7, 2008

Airfare: $549

Meals: $170

Mileage and parking: $96

Hotel: $515

Registration fee: $445

Total: $1,775

Fauver, a training officer at the county jail, said the American Jail Association conference taught her how older and younger generations communicate differently.

“A lot of the new hires we have are young. You know how generation gaps go. It’s just a lot harder in this day and age to understand some of the new thinking and attitudes we have.”

Fauver said she learned that younger workers tend to get bored easier and “need more activity” to stay interested in their work.

“It’s more of an understanding between the generations and the way we communicate,” she said.

At the conference, Fauver said, she participated in an activity where she offered young people a job to “see if they would be interested.”

Since she attended the course, Fauver said she’s communicating better with younger new hires, and they’re acclimating to a dangerous job more quickly. “They seem to be more accepted – at least that’s the way I kind of perceive it. They’re more welcomed here. They’re not on guard.”

Darren Ullmann, Cowlitz County sheriff’s deputy

In-Custody Death Conference, Las Vegas, Nev.

Oct. 28-31, 2008

Airfare: $272.50

Meals: $96

Hotel: $266.09

Registration fee: $595

Total: $1,229.59

Ullmann attended the In Custody Death conference to learn about a controversial phenomenon called “excited delirium,” which has been attributed to suspects’ deaths in police custody.

Ullmann, a firearms and use-of-force instructor for the sheriff’s office, said he wanted to know more about the condition — where suspects become agitated, their body temperatures and heart rates spike and they seem to show extraordinary strength.

Undersheriff Duane Engler said he knows of one “excited delirium” death involving a Cowlitz County man in 2007.

The use of Tasers and pepper spray have been blamed for the phenomenon, Ullman said, although no one’s sure what exactly causes it.

Lawyers, doctors, law enforcement and representatives of the Taser gun’s manufacturer attended the conference, Ullman said.

Conference sessions included “A street evaluation of mental illness” and “The clinical impacts of Taser and other conductive energy devices on humans,” according to a schedule provided by the county.

Ullmann said he’ll teach much of what he learned to other sheriff’s officials in January and February. He said he wants the department’s deputies to “understand what they’re dealing with when they’re out in the street.”

That, Engler said, can get paramedics on the scene faster and, perhaps, save a suspect’s life.

Ullmann stayed three nights at The Orleans Hotel and Casino, about a mile off the Vegas strip.

“I hate the fact that it was in Las Vegas. Personally I’m not a gambler,” he said. “I wish it was local.”

Sue Baur, Cowlitz County prosecutor; and James Smith, Cowlitz County deputy prosecutor.

Seventh North American Conference on Shaken Baby Syndrome, Vancouver, B.C.

Oct. 5-7, 2008

Mileage: $316

Meals: $102.69

Hotel: $1,495

Registration fee: $590

Total: $2,504

Baur said she and Smith decided to attend October’s shaken baby conference after putting Benjamin Pingle on trial earlier this year. Pingle was accused of causing injuries that led to his infant daughter’s death. He was convicted of first-degree manslaughter in May.

The case, Baur said, had involved incredibly complex medical research.

Baur said she and Smith attended the Vancouver, B.C., conference so they can effectively prosecute future shaken baby cases, which, she said, are increasingly common locally. Andrew Steven Kennedy was found guilty and sentenced to 31 1/2 years in prison last year for the 2004 killing of a baby girl. The prosecutors office has handled other cases as well, Baur said.

The prosecutors, Baur said, learned about defense strategies, got hooked up with a network of expert witnesses and gained a better understanding of the medical issues involved with these cases.

“As a practical matter, we learned something that will never go away,” Baur said.

Baur and Smith charged the county for three nights at the Westin Bayshore in Vancouver. The pair apparently didn’t charge the county for many of their meals. In addition, each drove separately in their own cars, Baur said, and charged the county for one way of travel, which amounted to $158 each.

“Gas is so expensive,” Baur said. “I didn’t want the county to pay for both ways. If we wanted to go to the training, we can suck it up and pay for the rest of it.”

Joel Treichel, corrections officer, Cowlitz County Jail

Jail to Community: Successful Transition conference, Fort Lauderdale, Fla.

July 20-24, 2008

Airfare: $584

Meals: $182

Hotel: $421

Registration fee: $445

Total: $1,632

The county sent four corrections officials to this conference, at a total cost of $6,119.

The event focused on ways to keep offenders from getting arrested again and returning to jail, a hot topic in Cowlitz County.

Treichel said he learned about the re-entry program in Broward County, Fla., which helps inmates find jobs, housing and clothing when they are released back into the community.

County officials, he said, are interested in adopting similar programs here to cut down on the county’s high rates of recidivism. Treichel said ideas from the conference include handing out a brochure telling inmates where they can find help in the community, such as getting work and finding a new place to live. Another, Treichel said, is creating community centers where former inmates come to check in, get help with their resumes and find other services.

Corrections Director Marin Fox Hight, who sent the officials to the conference, said her department is also adopting a GED program through Lower Columbia College. She said she sent four people to the conference because she wanted a broad range of employees, from corrections officers, a manager and an offender services employee, to get the information.

Overall, Treichel said, the conference prompted a change in thinking for corrections officers from regarding themselves as mere “warehousers” of prisoners to people who can actually help someone turn their lives around.

“It’s not something like: Joel’s going to go in and, hey, here’s a brochure and all of a sudden everybody’s problems are going to be gone,” he said. “This is more of an overall state and federal shift in corrections thinking.”

The problem, though, is that tight county budgets may keep the corrections department from using the new ideas he learned in Florida, Treichel said.

Asked if the trip was worthwhile, Treichel sighed. “Let me put it this way: If we can have a re-entry program that is successful, then yes. If it stops mamas from leaving their kids and stops daddies from going to prison for years and years, then definitely.”

But, he added: “If it’s, OK, we went and now we can’t do anything because our budget is in the toilet if you will, then it’s a frustration.”

Alicia Thompson, deputy director of communicable disease and community health, Cowlitz County health department

Association of State and Territorial Health Offices and National Association of City and County Health Officials joint conference, Sacramento, Calif.

Sept. 9-12, 2008

Airfare: $221

Meals: $112

Hotel: $287

Registration fee: $405

Presentation materials and shuttle service: $70

Total: $1,095

Thompson said she brought two important ideas back from this meeting. One, she said, is methods for getting new employees up to speed quickly and efficiently, including giving them a “welcome packet.”

The other is the importance of quickly alerting a network of local health providers during a disease outbreak. “If You have more people that are aware and watching, you can get it stopped much quicker,” she said.

The ideas, Thompson said, are being adopted throughout the department.

Thompson had another reason for attending the conference: She presented a paper she wrote with health director Carlos Carreon on matching the services of the local health department with the needs of the community and the state.

She said she celebrated with a $22 shrimp and ginger dinner and a glass of wine at a Sacramento Thai restaurant. The county reimbursed her $15, per the travel policy, for the meal.

Previous Next

Roudyruss wrote on Dec 7, 2008 7:07 AM:

" What a waste of OUR money!!! "

crowsfeet wrote on Dec 7, 2008 7:35 AM:

" These people all seem to be educated. The seminars they attended have tons of available information already on the internet. Google the lines below;

'gen x and y work ethics'

'excited delirium'

'Shaken Baby Syndrome'

'Jail to Community: Successful Transition'

'Association of State and Territorial Health Offices and National Association of City and County Health Officials joint conference' "

taco wrote on Dec 7, 2008 7:42 AM:

" Looking at most of the numbers, I would agree that these people are being responsible with the tax dollars. If you would look at business-people's expense reports, these would look mighty frugal indeed. I am also inclined to believe that our county workers actually GO to the workshops presented at these conferences and share the good ideas (and not so good ones) to their colleagues. Well done, county workers. I hope these conferences give you a renewed sense of job satisfaction. I appreciate your good services. I am pretty sure these spent dollars pay for themselves three or four times over by the good ideas the workers bring back. "

bizowner wrote on Dec 7, 2008 7:44 AM:

" Axel hit the nail on the head - the Commissioners don't know how to say "NO" to descretionary budget requests. $250k here, $350k there, another $300k over there and before you know it you are up to some real money. The good news is balancing the budget will be easy - they just have to learn two letters: "N O". That will also help when it comes to tax increases! "

Lucky7 wrote on Dec 7, 2008 8:23 AM:

" Travel for work is sometimes necessary, but I'm not sure about $2K trips for motivation? My last company trip which was over 3 years ago was myself and 1 employee to San Diego for (3) 12 hour days to learn a new software system we use. We flew Southwest (cheap), we rented a Ford Tauras (cheap), we stayed at the Super 8 (cheap), and we didn't eat fancy food. We stuck to Dennys, and fast food. The whole trip was less than a thousand dollars, not including the $395 each cost of the seminar. My point is sometimes times it's necessary and when it is it can be done within reason! "

Beer&Skittles wrote on Dec 7, 2008 9:12 AM:

" I don't actually have a problem with any of these, here's why: Washington State, years ago, through it's WA State Criminal Justice Training Commission used to provide TONS of training. Traning, by the way, that is required every year, by hours, for every law enforcement and corrections position. Today, they virtually provide none but the academy, because of budget cuts. These trainings are incredibly essential. You can't imagine the difference in the work ethics of Gen X & Y's (NOT the same as previous generations), and the essential need of our prosecutors to understand, to the 'Nth degree, about shaken baby syndrome, the ability for in-custody death issues to be well understood are all ESSENTIAL to the safety and security of our community. If the State could or would provide, no one would have a problem with this, but they don't so there's no alternative. Many of these departments have to certify that their employees have this training or they don't meet their accreditation to taxpayer standards. So, questioning these expenditures is like taxpayers saying, You must stand up, however, we won't give you legs with which to stand. "

RTLL wrote on Dec 7, 2008 9:32 AM:

" Personally, I don't see anything horribly out-of-line or abusive although a $1495.00 hotel bill in British Columbia sorta stands out, doesn't it? Anyway... You gotta keep up-to-date with what's going on in the world in any line of work. I've been to umpteen conferences in my time. Some worth every penny, others a total waste of time. The problem is you can't always tell how valuable the conference will be ahead of time. You pay yer money and take yer chances. "

cynic954 wrote on Dec 7, 2008 10:03 AM:

" Leave it to baur and smith to avoid a motel 6 like the plague. Must be nice to spend $250 of tax payers money each, a night on a room. Yea they sure "sucked it up " alright. "

tdn reader wrote on Dec 7, 2008 10:45 AM:

" It's amazing to me the odasity of some of the readers of tdn. Read the comments when an article gets published about a criminal that continues to reoffend. Readers question the system and wonder why more isn't being done to fix these problems. Then, read the comments on this story, they want a perfect world but they don't want to foot the bill. All of these trips seem justified to me. Think of the alternatives...a mother shakes her baby and kills it then walks free because prosecuters do not have the tools or knowledge to make the charges stick...what would you think then? "

Martha Splatterhead wrote on Dec 7, 2008 10:49 AM:

" "Googling" a topic is a great way to learn and gain information; I've taken a half dozen courses online so am not opposed to online learning. However, nothing online comes even close to the insights gained from face to face hands on interactive learning demonstrated in the classroom type environment. "

91uw wrote on Dec 7, 2008 11:12 AM:

" Ridiculous spending. Bauer and Smith drive seperate?? Then "suck it up" and only get reimbursed for fuel one way. Are the people in these positions not supposed to know anything before they get the jobs? The county needs to do a better job of hiring people if we have to farm out training. Would like to see records of them passing the training on to their peers or one, just one instance that the training helped. These are frivilous trips that can be avoided with a little reasearch. Not that I dont trust them but.... "

Ms. Z wrote on Dec 7, 2008 11:37 AM:

" Some of these comments are rather humorous if not sad. Do we really want the deputy director of communicable disease and community health googling information if there is some sort of outbreak? Do we really expect these people to rely soley on the knowledge they aquired prior to being hired without the ability to seek out and learn the most up-to-date information available? I have heard complaints about Ms. Baur not being a capable prosecutor yet when she attempts to increase her knowledge there are complaints that she did not stay at the Motel Six. I drive around Longview regular to see these glass houses some of you live in. It is so easy to judge though I suppose in total anonymity in the comfort of your own glass house totally lacking responsiblity. "

Regular Reader wrote on Dec 7, 2008 11:57 AM:

" TDN, you're looking for scandals where none exist. Investing in the workforce, particularly where you're "training-the trainers" as indicated here, always pays. It looks like the per diem is reasonable (even pretty low, considering major city food amd hotel costs). The "no booze" policies are normal and apparently followed--the $100 bottle of wine comment from the article was inappropiriate.

I expect my government officials, prosecuters, etc to be educated and current--not some yokels getting their professional education from Google.

Looking up a topic on the internet isn't the same as getting first hand information and training-- that's a pretty big stretch. "

RTLL wrote on Dec 7, 2008 12:49 PM:

" 91uw: I'm sure they knew something before they got there jobs, but education and training does not stop once you get hired....not in any profession I've ever been in, at least. With the possible exception of the one hotel bill I already mentioned I don't see anything unreasonable about the expenses and I have no objection to our civil servants becoming better trained and more informed. Its not like Longview is the educational and cultural hub of the western world....sometimes you gotta leave town to learn new things "

day2day wrote on Dec 7, 2008 12:52 PM:

" Thie article and most comments are nitpicking...

I will add to some of the nitpickers.

As another person that has been to numerous conferences (and yes some are not too great, some are excellent)... if you don't stay in the hotel of the conference (or reserved by the conference) you often miss out on a lot.

About staying home and researching on the internet...Is this how you educate yourself? Did you do college from home? Do you keep your children home and teach them via the biased internet? Or do you send them to learn from educated experts in the field despite the high cost?

A nitpicking article invites, nitpicking, inappropriate, not-well informed comments. My comments are not to further nitpick, but to show this is such a narrow view of a topic, that The Daily News cannot be the proper forum this discussion. "

FinancialCancer wrote on Dec 7, 2008 12:54 PM:

" I think the trips are fine. BUT the county should limit the reimbursement rate for hotel just like they do the food. It makes little difference to me that Sue "sucked it up" and then splurged on a luxury five star hotel. There should be a rate and anything over should be paid out of pocket. Otherwise keep up the good work. "

Tortoise wrote on Dec 7, 2008 1:05 PM:

" Totally worth it. Especially the deputy learning about "excited delirium." That $1229 class could save the county a multimillion dollar lawsuit. "

dogshead wrote on Dec 7, 2008 1:07 PM:

" Poor attempt to stir it up Daily News. Every quote refers to the frugal nature and need for the training. Is the reporter's comment 'you be the judge' stating the facts of a story or leading readers to alarm. I have faith in our county leaders. These trips were taken in a very different financial situationthan we are in now. They will make appropriate adjustment without tabloid media. "

Hauskapoika wrote on Dec 7, 2008 1:18 PM:

" I traveled extensively on business, but that was BEFORE the advent of the internet. After the internet became viable, much of my business could be handled right at my desk, and travel expenses were cut by 75%. Much of the info gathered at conferences and seminars can now be done at home or the office. Travel should now be limited to trips that are absolutely REQUIRED or NECESSARY - not because you think you might learn something. You can share experiences now without traveling.
Supervisors need to cut the travel budgets severely because most trips are not REQUIRED or NECESSARY. Finally, you don't spend the public's money to reward an employee with a trip because of good performance. Good performance is EXPECTED on any job. What do they do with employees who do not do a good job? "

crowsfeet wrote on Dec 7, 2008 1:24 PM:

" In the modern world there are many modes to gain training and maintain an up-to-date knowledge base for most professions. Traveling to seminars is an expensive and mostly no longer required form of maintaining currency. Conference calls, on-line training, video conferencing, inter-active video, on and on. Un-limited coverage of almost anything on the internet. A true cost controlling business would use modern technology to eliminate waste. By the way company training was my profession, use your available tools. "

racingrocks wrote on Dec 7, 2008 1:32 PM:

" This is an absolutely needless article that stirs a pot not needing to be stirred.Those trips allseem legit and that type of thing is a neccessity in any business.I dont see anything out of line and am happy to pay for this training for our public servants.Some people will just complain about anything "

viper wrote on Dec 7, 2008 1:34 PM:

" I don't see alot wrong with it if it is for training and that person trys to train someone when they get back instead of keeping it a secret for only them to know
this I don't have a problem with. heck if Brian Baird can take a trip to the south American continent and say Washington is going to benefit from it and you be leave it then why not. you can justifie anything ask Brian Baird I'm sure he can tell you how his Trip helped Washington state "

cynic954 wrote on Dec 7, 2008 2:41 PM:

" ms ZZZZZZZ is ones ability to gain knowledge directly tied to the cost of their room? As for the claim that they only charged the tax payers for fuel oneway. At $4 a gallon thats 39 1/2 gallons. Vancouver B.C. is only a little over 270 miles So rather than ride together they each took a vehicle that only gets 7 mpg. I dont have a problem with any other trips other than baurs. "

Gondolapete wrote on Dec 7, 2008 3:24 PM:

" So a course on how to learn the difference between younger and older workers makes sense????? What did they learn? That 20 and 30somethings are babies and need to take naps during the day because they get bored??? "

northender wrote on Dec 7, 2008 3:39 PM:

" The media is the watchdog of the government in our society.TDN should be thanked for this article , It spurs thought into government process and may sharpen focus on priorities. Public employees work for the tax payer and should always be open to customer review , comment and suggestions. "

Ms. Z wrote on Dec 7, 2008 3:44 PM:

" My point was not that knowledge is tied to the cost of the room, my point was that the article was combed over for a reason to complain. Oh wait, that is exactly what you did with my comment too Cynic, I love consistency! "

southbound wrote on Dec 7, 2008 5:06 PM:

" Actually this article is not a useless post but rather a report that tends to keep things in line. People in public office need to know that someone is watching. "

BlueSkies wrote on Dec 7, 2008 5:23 PM:

" Can't they use the internet? I would think this information would be available for those who truly are interested either online or via a DVD. The cost savings would allow for a catered lunch and still save the taxpayers money.
I know that in the past some city council members have gone on trips to the National League of Cities (which is in early December), skipped the classes and went Christmas shopping instead. What a waste, we have much more urgent needs for our tax money than that!!! "

starfire wrote on Dec 7, 2008 6:11 PM:

" Looks like the prosecuters could have stayed home and gotten the entire conference and handouts on DVD for $15 total. I am not sure networking is worth the $1489 over that plus wages. "

Roudyruss wrote on Dec 7, 2008 6:13 PM:

" Sending four jailers to Florida at a cost of 6 thousand dollars is a huge waste. A jail gaurd has nothing to do with an offender once they walk out of the jail. If probation officers were sent then mabey I might understand but a guard has one job, to keep an offender secure in the jail intill the time of release. And from personal experience, that is all they do. "

starfire wrote on Dec 7, 2008 6:21 PM:

" I also must wonder about the DIRECTOR of Communicable Diseases at our health department not already knowing the importance of networking with health care providers when a disease outbreak occurs. That seems like a basic fundamental of the role that should be known (even if just from common sense!)that someone in that position should have a handle on well before being hired. "

starfire wrote on Dec 7, 2008 6:26 PM:

" The corrections officer who went to Florida could have saved a few bucks on expenses by joining the American Jail Association and paying the member rate for conference registration instead of paying the higher non-member registration rate. Plus he would have had the benefits of the AJA membership for a year. "

TK wrote on Dec 7, 2008 6:27 PM:

" Sounds to me like money well and carefully spent. Thanks, county employees for all you do to improve our community. "

figgerditout wrote on Dec 7, 2008 8:08 PM:

" I have no problem with this. Education costs money. If they were sitting in their office researching things on the internet, someone would complain that they are waisting time. Not only are these people educating themselves, but they are networking also. I do not believe any of these people are abusing the perks or padding the expense report. As far as cheap motels go,,,, would you send your daughter to a cheap motel in a strange city,,, to save a few bucks? Just a thought. "

Hershey's Squirt wrote on Dec 7, 2008 8:31 PM:

" Man, I'll tell ya what. Those conferences in Vegas are the best! I recommend them highly. "

bmoc wrote on Dec 7, 2008 9:11 PM:

" How about TDN release the names of executives and their expense reports for business trips taken in the last month. This is definitely stirring a pot - you didn't find anything lavish, so why print it? Nobody went to the Galapagos Islands for crying out loud. "

CRSA wrote on Dec 7, 2008 9:47 PM:

" As a local tax payer...I say more power to you! I didn't not see one expenditure on the above list that made me raise an eyebrow. Honestly, if anything, I was a little surprised at how little money was being spent. $40 a day for food is nothing. Especially, in Vegas or Florida. Kudo's to Fox-Hight and other county admin. for promoting education and rewarding hardworking employees with this sort of professional development. "

loudly wrote on Dec 8, 2008 2:03 AM:

" lol, what a useless article! how much money was spent for tdn to research and report on this? Too much I bet! Gondolapete and Roudyruss, you two are so far out of touch! You both exemplify all that is wrong with america when it comes to the uneducated being allowed a public voice. As to TDN, I bet you could lower the price of your newspaper if you simply cut out this worthless drivel! Of course I don't expect this to be printed since it doesn't seem to follow TDN's agenda. "

greenbean wrote on Dec 8, 2008 9:04 AM:

" I review travel expenses for my company as part of my daily work. I don't see anything out of line here, actually it all looks pretty conservative. The one comment I would add is when times are tough, the budget for travel needs to be scrutanized. It is not always required to fly across the country to attend training. It may take more work, but look for more local (west coast) classes that fit your needs. In addition, it's important to plan in advance the training that is required, and then search out the best price for that training - not just go to the first conference that looks good. There are many web conferences and online trainings that are just as good, and much less expensive. "

julietorell wrote on Dec 8, 2008 9:24 AM:

" If you read the article, the county doesn't pay for "luxuries", they take the "red eye" flight when possible and are only allowed $40 max. per day for meals. I don't think these expenses are unreasonable, and I agree that it is important for our prosecutors, public safety, and health workers to be able to attend seminars, etc. to help them perform their duties in the best way possible. In the private sector, the expenses are many times this for a "seminar"; even people who work for charities,and non-profits have expenditures to attend seminars! Yes, the internet is truly a podium for anonymous arm-chair quarterbacking, but there are a few of us that use our real names. If you can do a better job, attend law school and start prosecuting, will you? There are tons of cases and scumbags that need accountability, and victims who need justice- step on up to the plate! "

cynic954 wrote on Dec 8, 2008 9:45 AM:

" ms ZZZZZZZZ Im so glad that you are independently wealthy with nothing better to do than drive around looking at glass houses. If baur had spent 5 minutes at expeidia.com she could have got her room for $106.33. Why did she have to stay at a luxury hotel anyway. "

TDN Bad Boy wrote on Dec 8, 2008 10:26 AM:

" Some people are questioning the need for this article or accusing the TDN of trying to stir up trouble. I would dispute both. At the last commissioners' meeting, I overheard one person in the audience talking about what travel is necessary. I think this is an excellent look at the budget in that regard. I would like to see much more of this at the city and county level, and even the state level. This helps keep the public informed and it lets officials know that they are being watched. What do you think would be the consequences if stories like this never were done? I hate to think of the corruption that could lead to. "

stink wrote on Dec 8, 2008 12:03 PM:

" tdn would have doctors use the same surgical techniques from when they were in med school. Tax accountants using the same tax laws as when they were in college. "

mama mia wrote on Dec 8, 2008 4:26 PM:

" That may be true, but Dr.'s and accountants pay to further their own education to further their career. Thus making a better business for the people who pay them. "

Im_not_saying wrote on Dec 8, 2008 5:56 PM:

" Im glad we have so many omni-professionals in our midst who know everything, but do nothing but complain. It's obvious by what goes on in these bergs that all the authorities have to do is weather some anonymous comments posted on a blog then do whatever they want. The facts are that physicians and accountants use these "seminars" as deductions at the end of the year - therefore still making money off of them as "job-related expenses." - HOWEVER, staying in a $250 room is beyond asinine. Just like the $40 allowance for food, they should also have a hotel allowance based on where they are traveling, how long they are staying, and what the average price for a room is in the area. If someone wants to live it up in a high dollar suite, they should pay for it out of their own pocket. These seminars are not "vacations" they are an opportunity to learn. A daily budget of 175$ for food, transportation and lodging is not out of line. (100$ hotel, $40 food, $35 transportation) "

country gal wrote on Dec 8, 2008 7:47 PM:

" Sometimes I'm a little bit confused. It seems when applying for these job positions, you need to have a college degree of some sort. Now we, as taxpayers, are expected to pay for their seminars for training on what? What did they learn in college? "

Rastor wrote on Dec 8, 2008 9:51 PM:

" Learning takes more than what can be found here in Longview. And community means more than just your own town. Other cities, other people, other groups have different ideas, different cultures, and different plans. Without learning something different, we are all fated to doing the same things over and over again expecting different outcomes...which is one definition of "insanity". Get out, see the world or at least your own region or country. You might actually learn something, or teach someone else something useful. "

greenbean wrote on Dec 8, 2008 11:01 PM:

" Country gal, it's called continuing education, and most employers fund it because it benefits them to have their employees current in their field of practice. Some people also pay for their own continuing education as it may be required to keep a license current. Obviously there are new techniques, laws, etc. to be learned after college. Another comment, the price of the hotel varies with the location of the training - I'm sure Vancouver is expensive and $250 is not out of line. I stayed there over twenty years ago in a nice hotel and paid $190. Yes, you could stay out of town in a Motel 6, I guess, but then you would have additional travel and time not to mention parking to get to the conference location. "

RTLL wrote on Dec 8, 2008 11:05 PM:

" Country gal, I'm sure they learned a lot in college. But what if that was 5-8-10-15 years ago? Do you want civil servants who stop learning once they get hired? Wouldn't you rather have them informed and up-to-date? Its very common for employers to pay for training/education updates. It just so happens they we the taxpayers are the employers :-) "

observer wrote on Dec 10, 2008 6:28 AM:

" Any of you who are complaining about the Prosecutor's office spending what they did to go to the seminar on "Shaken Baby Syndrome" obviously did not sit through the Pingle trial. The defense brought in 2 "expert witnesses" that were very costly to taxpayers. One of these witnesses claimed there is no such thing as shaken baby syndrome. Even after Mr. Pingle was found guilty by the jury, the judge decided that he should be out of jail pending appeal, which could take years. Talk about a waste of time and taxpayer money, why bother with a trial if the judge is just going to let the criminal out anyway? Prosecutors need all the pertinent information available to prosecute people who abuse their children. I personally think it was a small price to pay for a seminar and I am grateful for the time, effort and commitment the prosecutors put into their jobs. "

1arealocal wrote on Dec 17, 2008 1:31 AM:

" This article was a waste of time and print. Typical left wing, liberal media bias... "

Littlejon wrote on Dec 23, 2008 10:29 PM:

" I love the accusation by 1arealocal of this article being "Typical left wing, liberal media bias..." That's typical of a self-centered, self-rightous right-wing ditto-head. Any time that raw facts are presented, without Limbaugh-style editorializing, it's liberal bias!!! But it's ok to put an Arabian horse judge in charge of FEMA and that's a smart use of money. It's ok to subsidize the oil industry while all funding is cut to alternative fuel sources. Wind power technology developed in the U.S. fled to Denmark as a result and now we have to import our wind turbines. Yeah, we need more compassionate conservitism to offset all of this liberal fact check. "

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